CP A/D "Arenas"?

Discussion in 'Mapping Questions & Discussion' started by Lord Ned, Jan 3, 2011.

  1. Lord Ned

    Lord Ned L7: Fancy Member

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    It seems that most A/D maps put the capture point in an 'arena' type location. (Not a Arena gamemode type, but the combat-arena type), where blue will have x entrances in the general area into it, and then a multitude of routes, cover, and options once inside this big area.

    Then each arena is separated by a wall with a couple of routes through it and maybe a room or two for the attackers to hole up in, before it repeats again for the next CP.


    Is there any sort of method to this? Or does it just come from studying maps and thinking critically about it.
     
  2. Bermuda Cake

    Bermuda Cake L9: Fashionable Member

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    Most a/d maps use a '2 and a half entrances' layout (think this was in grazr's A/D cp map article), as in 2 major entrances and one minor one. Look at dustbowl's first control point:

    Major:
    Far left entrance is direct to the point, but is also exposed to the rest of the map. It offers some cover in the middle, however, with the rocks, and the spawn is not exposed due to the shed. Reds can shoot onto this route from the capture point door, but they are exposed to sniper fire due to the sightline, while blues can avoid it thanks to the slight corner in the rock.

    The far right entrance is the furthest walk to the point and the furthest walk out of spawn, but it allows a safe(r) flanking route. The shed gives the blues cover, which allows them to cover teammates on the other side of the trench. Reds can again shoot onto this path from the platform side of the point, but they are exposed mainly to fire from the right side, as well as from the trench.

    Minor:
    The trench route is minor in the sense that the fighting ability of a player taking this route is minor. It offers a good route for spies and other sneaky players to flank the point and attack from behind, but it is very exposed due to it's lack of cover and height disadvantage. Bear in mind, however, that any red positions to fire down on the trench can also be attacked by the advancing blues from somewhere else.

    The best way to approach map making is to look at other maps, but try to only take the theory, not whole layouts.
     
  3. LeSwordfish

    aa LeSwordfish semi-trained quasi-professional

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    It makes sense: try and build a good-looking cap with good gameplay, and sooner or later you get a variant on an arena.
     
  4. Sergis

    aa Sergis L666: ])oo]v[

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    I like when people answer their own questions :D
     
  5. Seba

    aa Seba DR. BIG FUCKER, PHD

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    I think he meant reason, or purpose.

    I've always thought that the reason why gameplay areas are separated by large cliffs/buildings/etc. is to block visibility and VVIS. I can't really think of any other purposes for those, other than to serve as a forward base.

    Also, the dev commentary on Half-Life 2: Lost Coast mentions some stuff about the fighting areas (which they also call arenas) which Valve stick to when creating levels.
     
  6. Mr. Happy

    Mr. Happy L6: Sharp Member

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    It's easier. But it also helps pace things, as you play you've got your safety zone, then the hallway to the arena which is your alert zone and the arena which is your danger zone. Making something with a more flowing layout that doesnt feel like box-hall-box-hall-box is much harder (but I think if you pull it off much better). Look at upward for example, personnally I think that if you exlude the last CP it is the most well designed map. It has clearly defined "arenas" but it has a much more open and interconnected flow and the spatial bounds of it's arenas are more often formed by the maps overall curve, the height disparities, cover, transition of type of area (i.e. shacks and stairs next to flat areas even if they are totally open to each other), and difficulty of aiming from one location to another than by walls or hallways.
     
  7. Icarus

    aa Icarus

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    I think it's part of Valve's style to include arenas and gates. Gates being a single, wide, passage that's usually near the CP. This is usually done with the diode-design of chokepoints. The team that controls the nearby CP also controls the high ground, or health/ammo. That way, neither team can easily sneak by an entire team. It helps with pacing and the movement of a front line.
     
  8. Lancey

    aa Lancey Currently On: ?????

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    If you use arenas, don't make them so divisionary of the map. Gravelpit works because it doesn't feel like three separate areas, because the set pieces from the scenes move into the next control point. Consider using fences, tall props, and windows to make your map feel more connected. Take Goldrush as an example. It's a very, very close quarters map but it feels open because it's connected.
     
  9. Prestige

    aa Prestige im not gay anymore

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    Gravelpit doesn't feel like 3 separate areas? :/