Apollo

Discussion in 'Map Factory' started by Schmoe, May 11, 2009.

  1. Schmoe

    Schmoe L2: Junior Member

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    A reverse CTF using a neutral intel located under a rocket. Pick it up and take it to the opposing team's capture area. Be careful not to fall (or be pushed) into the pits of death.

    Things that have changed from A0:

    • Lowered the flag's return timer from 60s to 20s. Flag will revert to neutral after 10s.
    • Fixed the HUD/scoring system by reverting it to the default CTF mode.
    • Added a second route to the capture zone for both teams and adjusted some areas.
    • Updated the rocket in the center to have a RED/BLU skin depending on the side you are facing.

    I'm interested in feedback on the map. What can I do to make this map kick more ass?

    Thank you:
     
    Last edited: May 30, 2009
  2. Cerious

    Cerious L7: Fancy Member

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    ICTF is a redundant name: you might as well call cp_dustbowl "icp_dustbowl" because it is an invade kind of cp.

    If it has cps, it is a cp_ map. If it has intel, it is a ctf_ map regardless.
     
  3. Kronixx

    Kronixx L5: Dapper Member

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    looks like a solid start to somethin, i just worry when map makers include a line in the map description that says something like

    "My vision for this map was to empower Pyros as much as possible"

    I'm not saying your map is a failure off the start. No, nothing like that. I'm just saying, it's sometimes a sign that a lot of people may ignore a map if they hear it's designed to power up a specific class. Just somethin to chew on while you map :)
     
  4. Schmoe

    Schmoe L2: Junior Member

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    I've found that unless you name the map differently, folks expect to return the intel to their base. I could call it RCTF like so many others.
     
  5. Schmoe

    Schmoe L2: Junior Member

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    You may be right about that. The reason why I put it in there was that I had trouble getting Pyros to work in my original invade CTF map. In this one I took time to ensure that a Pyro has at least one spot that's one second away to find cover at any point in the map.

    Maybe empowering is a strong word. My main point is, if you d/l and play this map please let me know if a Pyro doesn't feel like an equal to the rest of the classes.
     
  6. DaFatCat

    DaFatCat L3: Member

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    The brushwork in your layout looks decent, but I am not all that fond of giving one class the advantage. It kind of ruins the experience for people who don't like playing pyro.

    Since the middle area is neutral, you should try to get a neutral rocket skin. It looks too much like the red team is defending. The team colors in the map should always be fairly balanced.
     
  7. Schmoe

    Schmoe L2: Junior Member

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    I updated the map description to be less confusing. "Empowering" wasn't really what I was aiming for. Basically I felt like most of my maps were giving the Pyro a disadvantage, so this layout was to help fix that problem.

    As for the neutral rocket... I need to learn how to skin. I had posted a request for someone to help me in this department since I felt like it didn't make sense for a RED rocket to be in a neutral area.

    Right now I'm more interested in getting opinions on how fun the map is in addition to it being balanced.
     
  8. Kronixx

    Kronixx L5: Dapper Member

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    ok well it sounds like you got the right head on your shoulders so i'm not so worried about the pyro problem, sounds like you understand the issue we're talking about. I'll check it out today sometime hopefully.
     
  9. DJive

    aa DJive Cake or Death?

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    I changed the title to reflect so.

    Map does look good so far!, i would agree to change the "I" however to "R" or drop it completely.

    I havent had a chance to player it yet, you should submit it to Sundays Gameday providing that it is
     
  10. Schmoe

    Schmoe L2: Junior Member

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    Ah thanks, I'm a map posting n00b. The map is fully functional.

    I'll be watching Star Trek in an IMAX on Sunday, so I'll submit for a future event. I'll be looking forward to getting a feel for health placements, possible areas for griefers to exploit, and the likability of the map.
     
  11. DJive

    aa DJive Cake or Death?

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    You dont need to be there, its recommended though. We can provide you with the demo of the gameday.
     
  12. Schmoe

    Schmoe L2: Junior Member

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    Cool, I'll submit it.
     
  13. A Boojum Snark

    aa A Boojum Snark Toraipoddodezain Mazahabado

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    Definitely needs more than one door into the base, too easy to lock down.
     
  14. Phobos

    Phobos L3: Member

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    This. This, this and this again.

    Once the engies figured out that they can stop every attacker at the only entrance, the game slowed down noticeably.

    In the beginning, there was some confusion about the objective of the map, but that is the nature of a new gamemode. The map played reasonably well, most of the action was around the middle part, especially once the entrances to the bases were locked down.

    Basically, the intel got carried to one base, was stopped at the entrance, got picked up by the other team and was stopped again at the other base entrance. Lots of back and forth, but still a stalemate.

    Add at least another entrance to the base. In the middle area are ramp like structures that lead nowhere. Maybe you could add a vent tunnel there that ends somewhere in the base , as a sneak route for spies.
     
  15. Schmoe

    Schmoe L2: Junior Member

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    Thanks for playtesting the map. I'll look into adding another route that will encourage the engineers to place their sentries further into the base.

    I'm also looking into adjusting the placement of health kits.

    EDIT: Took a look at the footage of the SourceTV demo.

    My take aways:

    At the very end having two sentries at the chokepoint was slowing things down.

    Some folks were expecting another route in the nook below the setup gates. I'm probably going to expand that space for the alternate route.

    Need a score board to replace the broken scoreboard on the HUD.
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2009
  16. captainAngry

    captainAngry L7: Fancy Member

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    I havn't had a ton of playtime on this map so I don't have any detailed feedback of my own. You have been receiving and responding to feedback on my forum and people definately seem to like that map, so that's good.

    The map is in our regular rotation now so that's gotta be worth something:
    [​IMG]
     
  17. Schmoe

    Schmoe L2: Junior Member

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    Thanks captainAngry.

    I'm continuing to tweak the map and make it more streamlined in the areas near the flag.
     
  18. Schmoe

    Schmoe L2: Junior Member

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    Updated to A1. Some balancing tweaks as well as an additional route to the capture zone.
     
  19. Schmoe

    Schmoe L2: Junior Member

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    After coming out of a few playtesting sessions here and on other communities, I've decided to let this mapping project die.

    I think the game mode is partially to blame due to fact that neither team has a sense for how well they are doing. In a good map+gamemode there's a tangible sense of accomplishment. In a CTF mode such as Apollo, one team picks up the flag and advances it into the other base and caps it. Rinse and repeat.

    However in a payload or CP map the teams get an immediate sense of accomplishment if they are winning/losing. Defending teams see the clock run down. Attacking teams will be further into the enemies base.

    The other problem is the number of routes at various angles with relatively short distances of each other. It is an excellent map for sneaky scouts, spies, and pyros, but folks don't have enough time to react to them. The map should provide adequate cover for these classes, but there should be enough visual feedback to cope with them at a distance when they are advancing and bobbing in and out of cover.
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2009
  20. captainAngry

    captainAngry L7: Fancy Member

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