A running list of why your map is terrible:

Discussion in 'Mapping Questions & Discussion' started by What Is Schwa, Feb 11, 2011.

  1. What Is Schwa

    What Is Schwa L6: Sharp Member

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    1) Too big. I don't like walking in real life. I don't want to play TF2 Walking Simulator

    2) Your transitions are awful. I am dizzy from turning three 180's in a row. Rethink that shit!

    3) Your spawn room isn't clever. Put me two inches from a door and let me hold W until I'm out of there.

    Edit: To makes things crystal clear
     
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    Last edited: Feb 11, 2011
  2. DJive

    aa DJive Cake or Death?

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    Try to be a bit more constructive Schwa.

    1. What can they do to correct the size? Links on helpful information.

    2. Explain your meaning on transitioning and how it can be improved. Links on helpful information.

    3. describe what you mean by "cleaver" and is there helpful links that will help make it better suited as a proper spawn?
     
  3. Sgt Frag

    Sgt Frag L14: Epic Member

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    What I think he means:

    1- nobody likes huge maps, long walking times to get to fight. Unfortunately everybody always complains walk times are too long. Best thing to do is to walk out sections of Valve maps which are proven to work pretty good, do it with a standard class like pyro that has an average speed and can't jump/shortcut.

    20 seconds is about the time it takes for people to get grumpy and it's usually only payload Valve maps that can be longer (off top of my head). But then you get a dispenser and better chance to survive for awhile.


    2-transitioning is areas between points. paths need to curve to give cover and be interesting, and to help optimize your map. But mazes are not fun. Put a couple 90 degree corners in, not 180's. The players skill points should go towards fighting, not navigating tunnels.

    For instance, if you go through a door that leads to stairs, you should be able to take a pretty straight path from door to stairs. Not turn right, go backwards, get on stairs, turn left, go foward. Just a nice smooth flow.

    3- large spawn rooms that take 20 seconds to get out of. Same as #2 really. It should be a pretty straight path straight out the door.
    An example I noticed a few days ago, in Hoodoo you go out of spawn, take a tight jig around a dumptruck, stumble on a hole in floor and then deal with enemy. Adding the jig around dumptruck and uneven floor just makes it hard and breaks the flow.
    In Egypt you have 20 seconds of tunnels to get to spawn door in one of the stages. It's dark and confusing. Poor spawn room design is not clever, it's annoying.

    Badwater has a few exits from tunnel for Blu (1st stage), but it only takes 3-4 seconds to get but and the tunnel is 'cover' to stop spam. It's not excessively big/twisty...
     
  4. Fr0Z3nR

    aa Fr0Z3nR Creator of blackholes & memes. Destroyer of forums

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    Who's map is he talking about? Or is this a basic "why your map isn't good" thing for generic maps.

    I don't see how this helps people, although, they are decent points.
     
  5. nik

    nik L12: Fabulous Member

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    4) You used the same textures for the floors as the walls. [dev]

    5) You used the same prop too many times.

    6) Your map is fullbright.

    7) You don't have cubemaps.
     
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  6. What Is Schwa

    What Is Schwa L6: Sharp Member

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    Sure thing! When you hear a wooshing sound overhead, it means you aren't tall enough to receive jokes. Keep growing!

    Why, make it smaller! Select everything in your map by finding the MAP tab and selecting "Map Properties." Next, hit ctrl-m to bring up the transformation window. Finally, select the "Scale" bullet and in each of the x, y, and z values type in 0.25. Presto!

    My apologies! When learning to map there is a lot of rough lingo you have to get used to. Here is a helpful place to search when reading these forums.

    Ooops! Did I say cleaver? Man. My face is red!
     
  7. What Is Schwa

    What Is Schwa L6: Sharp Member

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    He? I'm right here bro! You don't have to act like I'm not in the room.
     
  8. Fr0Z3nR

    aa Fr0Z3nR Creator of blackholes & memes. Destroyer of forums

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    You were offline at the time of posting.

    I'm with drp on this, if your going to come up with a list like this, you should be a little more constructive.
     
  9. Sgt Frag

    Sgt Frag L14: Epic Member

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    Why, make it smaller! Select everything in your map by finding the MAP tab and selecting "Map Properties." Next, hit ctrl-m to bring up the transformation window. Finally, select the "Scale" bullet and in each of the x, y, and z values type in 0.25. Presto!
    [/QUOTE]

    Presto, insta tiny map. I wouldn't really say that's good advice. That would require a map to be 400% larger than it should be to work right. It would require walls be at least 32 units wide...
     
  10. What Is Schwa

    What Is Schwa L6: Sharp Member

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    HEY! No making up stuff.
    I agree, constructive criticism is the pillar upon which this site is built. When discussing a specific map the more specific you can be really helps. I would sincerely appreciate if you deconstructed my original post and elaborated the ways I could improve. Thanks!
     
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  11. Fr0Z3nR

    aa Fr0Z3nR Creator of blackholes & memes. Destroyer of forums

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    Your right, I apologize, allow me to provide some better criticism.

    1) Whats too big? the map? intel room?. You should be more specific here. Sometimes though, big can be okay, as long as sightlines are everywhere.

    2) What transitions are you talking about? Textures, gameplay (like multi-stage maps)? Again, be specific. If this is a way to help newer mappers, you should really make it so they can understand what your saying.

    3) Clever? Not sure what you mean. Most spawn rooms are fine, as long as they are not absolutely huge and take half of set up time to get out of, mostly anything could go, as long as the resupply lockers (if applicable) are placed near the doors.

    Another piece of constructive criticism, your title of this thread makes it sound like the mapper is a horrible terrible person and that they should stop mapping (also makes it sound like an impending troll/flamefest). If you intend for this to be helpful, then try and change it (or get it changed) to something less harsh. Try like "List of things that should be considered when mapping"... or something like that.

    EDIT: Sorry, I saw the D in DJive and thought it was drp. My B.
     
  12. tovilovan

    tovilovan L6: Sharp Member

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    I am chojje and what is Schwa?
     
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  13. Zhan

    Zhan L5: Dapper Member

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    ftfy
     
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  14. What Is Schwa

    What Is Schwa L6: Sharp Member

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    Good point. If an admin would like the change the title to "A running list of why your map is terrible, and a lesson on indefinite articles." I would appreciate it.
     
  15. grazr

    aa grazr Old Man Mutant Ninja Turtle

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    Not exactly what i would call a comprehensive list of common map faults.

    Such as:
    Poor indoors lighting
    Low ceilings
    Over scaling
    Under scaling
    Unbalanced walk times
    Unbalanced spawn times
    Extensive LoS's
    Narrow corridors
    CP's cap to fast
    CP's cap too slow
    Too much ammo (engi griefing)
    Not enough ammo
    Not enough health
    Too many doorways
    Generally any dynamic door in the play area
    Use of coloured lights
     
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  16. honeymustard

    honeymustard L9: Fashionable Member

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    Your overlay ratios are wrong. If the overlay is 512x256, the width should be twice the height!! Get it right when you're resizing your overlays.

    this mainly happens with the calendar overlay in spawn rooms.
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2011
  17. tovilovan

    tovilovan L6: Sharp Member

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    Do you want to make me feel guilty? :(
     
  18. What Is Schwa

    What Is Schwa L6: Sharp Member

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    Don't feel bad Tovi. I like a thicker pin up girl.
     
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  19. Eyce

    Eyce L6: Sharp Member

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    You've made your CP2 as something that plays exactly like Badland's Spire on your 5CP Map.

    Try something else.
     
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2011
  20. Mr. Wimples

    Mr. Wimples L6: Sharp Member

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    1. You haven't carved nearly enough brushes

    2. Wheres the boss battle?

    3. You've only combined 2 gamemodes. Try 3, you can do better than that.
     
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