1. Hey there Guest,

    The game servers have moved to semi-dedicated hardware and IPs have changed. Please see front page server widget for up-to-date game server information.

A few Questions about Offical Map elements

Discussion in 'Mapping Questions & Discussion' started by Jesmonda, Apr 25, 2010.

  1. Jesmonda

    Jesmonda L1: Registered

    Messages:
    20
    Positive Ratings:
    8
    Hi all, i've just started working on my own map, i've got the design layout done in concept and i'm beginning to actually start making it, but there were i few things i wanted to clarify with you lot before i actually start putting all my time and effort into it, and i'd rather would like to streamline through my map without hinder (however i've got a feeling this won't ever happen)

    So i've got a few small questions i hope this rather clever community can answer for myself:

    1]
    How in earth could i re-create this?
    [​IMG]

    Am confused as to how you'd make this within Hammer, i found the wall on CP_Badlands

    2]
    Now i study many of the official maps to understand the task that i'm undertaking, however i noticed 2 things whenever i study a map in Hammer
    [​IMG]

    this is from Lumberyard, and this is what i notice when i look on the other side
    [​IMG]

    Why is it that they apply another texture to the other side the player can't see? i can only assume it's to the fact it saves complying time or memory space of sorts, anything else i missed in my assumption or have i the wrong idea in the first place?

    and another thing, whenever looking through a map, i consistently see these Hint brushes all over the place, why is it they exist and why are they there in the first place? or is this some sort of mystical developer secret:rolleyes:

    thanks if you've got anything on this :)
     
  2. alecom

    alecom L8: Fancy Shmancy Member

    Messages:
    516
    Positive Ratings:
    121
    The yellow side is Nodraw, it's so that your computer knows the face does not have to be rendered no matter the situation (ingame)


    For the curved wall, it's basically a bunch of triangles stuck together. If you press shift + v, you can edit the vertexes, and make a bunch of triangle brushes stick together as you illustrated yourself, so that they form a curve.
    http://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Hammer_Vertex_Tool



    For the hint brushes, you may want to read this
    http://rvanhoorn.ruhosting.nl/optimization.php?chapter=hints
    it's just a method of optimization so your computer knows what it should be rendering when ingame, depending on where you are, and where you are looking
     
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2010
  3. Leminnes

    aa Leminnes

    Messages:
    1,317
    Positive Ratings:
    902
    1 is pretty easy. You make a cylinder (which is on the bottom right, it's the dropbox under what says "primitives.") Pick cylinder, make one with, say, 16 sides (32 if your making the same exact thing as the first screen.) Make it whatever size is two times the size you want your curve. Then, you make squares around the curve and vertex edit them so they match the sides of the cylinder.

    I hope that makes sense. xD I might make a visual if it's too confusing.

    As for hint brushes, those are for optimization. They tell vvis where to put visleaves. Just read this: http://optimization.interlopers.net/
     
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2010
  4. grazr

    aa grazr Old Man Mutant Ninja Turtle

    Messages:
    5,436
    Positive Ratings:
    3,768
    http://www.snarkpit.net/snarkpower/articles/game/cat/pn/tp/31/Arch_Tool

    http://www.snarkpit.net/snarkpower/articles/game/cat/pn/tp/136/Basic_Clipping

    http://www.snarkpit.net/snarkpower/articles/game/cat/pn/tp/138/Clipping_Vs._Carving

    http://www.snarkpit.net/snarkpower/articles/game/cat/pn/tp/82/Room_corners

    http://www.snarkpit.net/snarkpower/articles/game/cat/pn/tp/145/Curved_Geometry_along_Curved_Surfaces

    http://www.snarkpit.net/snarkpower/articles/game/cat/pn/tp/86/Better_looking_buildings

    http://www.snarkpit.net/snarkpower/articles/game/cat/pn/tp/3/Curves

    These are basic guides to geometry, but bare in mind they're proper old school methods, these tutorials were made for Half-Life 1. The application of the tools, using the clip and vertex tools, remains the same still. So read through them and practice slicing up some geometry and using the vertex tool to reshape them into something more coherent.

    Beware that faces have to be flat otherwise the brush is invalid and will either be automatically deleted or reshaped (probably into something horrible) if left that way. Brushes have to be convex, concave brushes are also invalid.
     
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2010
  5. Tapp

    Tapp L10: Glamorous Member

    Messages:
    776
    Positive Ratings:
    215
    just make a wall, put a 32 sided sphere in the middle, and carve it.
     
  6. ParanoidDrone

    ParanoidDrone L3: Member

    Messages:
    147
    Positive Ratings:
    11
    :O

    I'd rather not think about what the result of that would be.
     
  7. Leminnes

    aa Leminnes

    Messages:
    1,317
    Positive Ratings:
    902
    Oh dear god.

    [​IMG]

    Terrible. Just Terrible.
     
  8. absurdistof

    aa absurdistof

    Messages:
    1,242
    Positive Ratings:
    396
    His head being the world of course.
     
  9. Grim Tuesday

    aa Grim Tuesday

    Messages:
    1,257
    Positive Ratings:
    376
    [​IMG]


    Dear god I hope you are joking...
     
  10. luxatile

    aa luxatile deer

    Messages:
    2,289
    Positive Ratings:
    1,380
    An alternative is to carve it and then fix the vertexes so they fit the grid.
     
  11. Terr

    aa Terr Cranky Coder

    Messages:
    1,591
    Positive Ratings:
    405
    1. The :clippingtool: to make triangular sections, and the :vertextool: to shape them so they all line up.
    2. Nodraw is used in places where you know the player will never see that side of a brush unless they're flying around as a spectator. It doesn't save compile-time or memory, but it can be beneficial for players with weaker 3D cards.
     
  12. YM

    aa YM LVL100 YM

    Messages:
    7,099
    Positive Ratings:
    5,920
    They'd fit the grid, anyway, carving a cylinder into a cuboid isn't exactly stressful to hammer, even if it is a 32 sided one.

    The disadvantage comes from the placement of the brushes, it would be less than ideal, which is always the case with carve. You don't get to pick, and the computer doesn't know any better, so you end up with a mess.

    Carving is only bad for complex shapes, don't let any thickies here put you off carving simple shapes, just know that for complex shapes it will take ages to calculate and just give you one hell of a mess. For anything more than a box into a wall for a doorway carving isn't really the best way to do stuff. We'll always tell you to vertex manipulate+clip before we tell you to carve, because you have total control and it only screws up if you don't understand shapes in 3D space.


    I personally here would create an arch, clip away 3/4 of it then vertex manipulate the points inside the wall to that point.
     
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
  13. Jesmonda

    Jesmonda L1: Registered

    Messages:
    20
    Positive Ratings:
    8
    Wow, Thank you guy's, knew i could depend on ya, i'll try all these methods when i find the time, but thank you anyway!

    and i laughed greatly at the some of the posts on the one the first page :D
     
  14. Jakkarra

    Jakkarra L4: Comfortable Member

    Messages:
    167
    Positive Ratings:
    36
    I volunteer to try this.

    I shall videotape it.
     
  15. Jakkarra

    Jakkarra L4: Comfortable Member

    Messages:
    167
    Positive Ratings:
    36
    Apparantly, spheres go up to 16 sides only.
     
  16. Nutomic

    Nutomic L11: Posh Member

    Messages:
    888
    Positive Ratings:
    177
    I highly doubt he actually meant sphere, pretty sure he means cylinder (sphere doesnt make sense to create this).
     
  17. lana

    aa lana Currently On: ?????

    Messages:
    3,077
    Positive Ratings:
    1,389
    He was joking.
     
  18. Jakkarra

    Jakkarra L4: Comfortable Member

    Messages:
    167
    Positive Ratings:
    36
    Oh i know, But i wanted to see how horrible it looked.

    it's HIDEOUS.