What do you like and dislike about Player Destruction

Erk said:

I.. I don't know what Player Destruction is.

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pd_watergate is the only default map that uses it. You get one item (like a bottle) for each player that you kill, and you have to deliver the items into a capture point every minute or so. Players can kill each other and steal items that are being carried. First team to deliver a set amount of items wins.

https://wiki.teamfortress.com/wiki/Player_Destruction

I like that PD is a spinoff of RD, yet became official before RD.

I like killing people and getting points for it.

I HATE HATE HATE HHHHHHHHHHHAAAAAAAAAAATTTTTTTTTEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE getting a bunch of points, then getting killed, those points stolen, and then used by the enemy to boost their score.

If I ever make a PD map, picking up points will instantly turn them in. No harm done

Moonrat said:

I like killing people and getting points for it.

I HATE HATE HATE HHHHHHHHHHHAAAAAAAAAAATTTTTTTTTEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE getting a bunch of points, then getting killed, those points stolen, and then used by the enemy to boost their score.

If I ever make a PD map, picking up points will instantly turn them in. No harm done

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Then youve made team death match....

I like how some new PD maps are using a constant capture zone, rather then the watergate one where its only active for 15-ish seconds and you are in the worst spot on the map to capture.

I like player destruction, but thats only because I dont tend to rely on my team too much. The gamemode itself supports individualism, thats the only reason why a Team Leader / most point holder buff was added, for some incentive to stay near team mates with high points.

Ya I used to have the instant pickup cores in watergate's old PD version ( _b5 , nov 2014 ) but we noticed that it was chaos: players were all over the map, and it was sorta-fun chaos but it really was lacking an objective. It was like a perpetual war zone; felt very unlike what you'd expect to see in a tf2 map.

Personally I like Watergate's rendition the best of what I've seen of custom pd maps (surprise!), I wrote a bit about the design in spoiler tags in the pd guide: https://tf2maps.net/threads/25958/

And ya I kinda dislike that also, Moonrat, that you can instantly lose your points to the enemy team. I tried fixing that in the pd_cuisine's rendition of PD (mentioned also in the notes in the link above) but my version of fixing it wasn't great - however I think it can be fixed without simply 'removing the parts that don't work as intended'!

Egan said:

Ya I used to have the instant pickup cores in watergate's old PD version ( _b5 , nov 2014 ) but we noticed that it was chaos: players were all over the map, and it was sorta-fun chaos but it really was lacking an objective. It was like a perpetual war zone; felt very unlike what you'd expect to see in a tf2 map.

Personally I like Watergate's rendition the best of what I've seen of custom pd maps (surprise!), I wrote a bit about the design in spoiler tags in the pd guide: https://tf2maps.net/threads/25958/

And ya I kinda dislike that also, Moonrat, that you can instantly lose your points to the enemy team. I tried fixing that in the pd_cuisine's rendition of PD (mentioned also in the notes in the link above) but my version of fixing it wasn't great - however I think it can be fixed without simply 'removing the parts that don't work as intended'!

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While I agree that TF2 maps need objectives from a narrative point of view, I think a pure DM map could be a lot of fun for people. I mean, you already have Hightower, Dustbowl, and 2Fort servers that are simply 32 man slobber knockers with no real goals other than murder. I think players would be open to a pure DM map if it has a fun layout. The only problem I can think about of this unmade PD map is that unbalanced teams would be an issue. And that could be solved through a number of means.

I also prefer when the capture zone is activated briefly between intervals, it helps add more of a focus between the big death matches and let's engineers set up and let players gather large amounts of points to deposit. What I like more specifically of watergate is that the UFO beam travels to 2 parts of the map (gate and balcony). This means that one team can control one zone while the other team controls the other. It adds a whole new layer to the game mode in my opinion, and gives one team a chance even when te enemies have one area on lockdown.

One constantly available capture zone can lead to messy gameplay where it feels back-and-forth like koth. At that point it is redundant to even have cores. Sure you could retake ownership of the land, but by then the enemy would've increased their score when they picked off your players.

I would like to see somebody create a map where there is one capture area, but it is usually disabled. I think that could be fun to experiment with!

Egan said:

Ya I used to have the instant pickup cores in watergate's old PD version ( _b5 , nov 2014 ) but we noticed that it was chaos: players were all over the map, and it was sorta-fun chaos but it really was lacking an objective. It was like a perpetual war zone; felt very unlike what you'd expect to see in a tf2 map.

Personally I like Watergate's rendition the best of what I've seen of custom pd maps (surprise!), I wrote a bit about the design in spoiler tags in the pd guide: https://tf2maps.net/threads/25958/

And ya I kinda dislike that also, Moonrat, that you can instantly lose your points to the enemy team. I tried fixing that in the pd_cuisine's rendition of PD (mentioned also in the notes in the link above) but my version of fixing it wasn't great - however I think it can be fixed without simply 'removing the parts that don't work as intended'!

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Would adding a 'disabled before pickup' timer give your team a few seconds to get the points, solve it? e.g.

5 seconds before pickup for 10-19 points.
10 seconds before pickup for 20-39 points.
15 seconds before pickup for 40+ points.

Davekillerish said:

Then youve made team death match....

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It's more of Kill Confirmed from Call of Duty.

Kill Confirmed: Kill an enemy and they drop a dog tag
Anyone on your team picks it up and it scores the kill,
anyone on the enemy team picks it up and it denies the kill.

Not TF2ish objective. You will effectively win the game by killing people directly while in other gamemodes you kill them to be able to do something else.

So, lack of objective for me