PL Swiftwater (swift revisited)

Thank you!

I like what you did to CP 1 a lot.

Yeah, I downloaded and isntalled FRC12 and I'm also able to reproduce the death ramp error on that small house on the right side. Door is fine before the point is capped, but once you cap CP1 the fun begins.

After the door has fallen I'm fine if I run straight up the middle, but if I touch the lower left or right corner of the ramp or come in from the side I die. I can seem to touch the edges of the ramp at its top, it seems to only happen on the lower half where it touches the ground. Maybe if you simply adjust the logic that activates the trigger_hurt to disable it after a second or two that might resolve it. If you already did that then I'm not sure why it's killing people after it has dropped.

Also, for some reason I have no problem running up the ramp, but if I try to go back through that doorway back down the ramp I sometimes get stuck.

That's really pretty much it. Aside from the ramp of death the reception was otherwise positive on the server (I'm also in Slaughterhouse like Klanana).

Still might need more changes to inspire fighting in that final yard area though. Part of the problem is that the area is very open, so it's almost impossible for engineers to be effective and so they build on the last point instead. Also, since the 2nd to last point is so close to the last point, they know they won't be able to set up a defensive position in time if they try to hold the prior point. So rather than risk a quick loss of the final point to defend a yard that is difficult to defend, people tend to elect build up in the more defensible position so they're ready.

Also, the 2nd point is still a big problem for blu. A lot of our games seem to get stuck on that second point. The ramp with the tight walls on each side create a death pit where blu people trying to push are incredibly vulnerable and have little to no room to maneuver. It often becomes a matter of just throwing bodies on the cart or controlling reds spawn doors. The walls also make demo spam from a great distance easy because the hill and walls effectively channel the grenades right in to the cart pushers.

Overall though the map is coming along quite nicely, and it is actually a pretty popular map on the server and has been since your original final release.

From what I recall (though this may have changed since I last played), the only way to get out of the pit is to run up to the defending end of the gully. This is bad for when the cart is at BLU's end of the gully, as it's harder to get back to without getting killed by a swarm of REDs on their end, and it's bad when it's at the end, as it almost encourages BLUs to jump into the gully as an alternate pathway. It should be a detriment at that point, not an assistance. The exit should be near the BLU spawn, so that when the cart is near the spawn BLU has an easier time getting back to it, and so that when the cart is near the point, if a BLU falls down the pit, then they have to run back to get out, giving RED a little bit of leeway.

I have a thread you may want to take a look at.

http://topnotchclan.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6180

In the courtyard before the 2nd to last cap, you can climb on the rock at the level bounds and see under the map. I can get a screenshot if you need.

There's also a place in Blu spawn that kills you instantly if you touch it, I can get a screenshot if need be.

...Have you sent this to Valve to be considered as an official map yet? It's definitely the standard of quality.

The only two gripes I have are the pit thing I mentioned above and the fact that the shack staircase kills you (which ShamanBond also mentioned).

Thank you for all your work schwa!

edit: found a minor no-draw bug (visible while double-jumping as the scout)

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/2893869/minor swiftwater frc12 bug.jpg

shouldn't be hard to fix

You shouldn't delete your work after you finalize it; if it ever gets made official, you may want to tinker with it afterward, and there's nothing wrong with that.

Anyway, did you see my post about the pit at the first point? Could you take that into consideration?

Oh yeah, I forgot to mention: getting out of the final red spawn is like going through a rat maze. Can you try to make that easier for Red to navigate?

That's probably always been my biggest issue with the map.

Yes, getting out of the final red spawn area was a lot easier around FRC4 or so.

Also, the last point is insanely easy now, I'm not sure what changed, maybe it's all the paths to the downstairs area but it's extremely difficult to defend.

Maybe move the 2nd last cap point back some or take it back out.

I don't think the cap should be removed, but I definitely think it should be pushed back a little; the stretch from the 3rd to 4th cap is way too long in comparison to the others. It's complicated by the whole "impossible to get out there" thing.

Definitely give Red an easier time with the final point.