SPHinx
L2: Junior Member
- Aug 29, 2009
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Why do you think this is? And please forgive the noob question: How does a good comp map differ from a good non-comp map?
Business as usual
- Thread starter Armadillo of Doom
- Start date
Why do you think this is? And please forgive the noob question: How does a good comp map differ from a good non-comp map?
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aa
- Jul 19, 2009
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90% of all comp maps are 5cp.
HOWEVER. this season of ESEA I will feature 6v6 koth viaduct, and will now go back to using ctf_turbine.
there is actually a lot of interest right now in the AD-CTF gamemode so dont hate on the comp players too much.
I know A/D CTF is going to be much harder to balance for 6v6 than CP maps but I think there's hope
HOWEVER. this season of ESEA I will feature 6v6 koth viaduct, and will now go back to using ctf_turbine.
there is actually a lot of interest right now in the AD-CTF gamemode so dont hate on the comp players too much.
I know A/D CTF is going to be much harder to balance for 6v6 than CP maps but I think there's hope
I would think the inherent balance difficultly would matter less to them, since they play two rounds and it's about who gets more points in less time. So any non-blatant balance issues would be offered equally to both teams.
Jack Riguel
L10: Glamorous Member
- Jul 19, 2009
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I think this is the question the whole of TF2M tries to answer. It's like the meaning of life... but in TF2 form.
- Sep 28, 2009
- 3,075
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That's the problem.
Vilepickle
Banned
- Oct 25, 2007
- 372
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Well if it takes a mapping contest to generate more interest in comp 5cp (I can't really see a contest for anything else) custom maps I might have to make yet another one.
The reason I doubt a contest for gravelpit maps would work is because ozfortress is already having one and gravelpit is largely a solo flyer. I doubt the comp community would take more than 1 (if that) map away from a contest like that, whereas a 5cp contest would see multiple maps getting good exposure.
The reason I doubt a contest for gravelpit maps would work is because ozfortress is already having one and gravelpit is largely a solo flyer. I doubt the comp community would take more than 1 (if that) map away from a contest like that, whereas a 5cp contest would see multiple maps getting good exposure.
- Apr 19, 2009
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I would not mind a 5CP contest but the only problem is that the # of maps produced would be staggering and will over saturate the market. Think the pl contest but with twice as many maps.
Vilepickle
Banned
- Oct 25, 2007
- 372
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Is the map market not over-saturated as it is? There are thousands of TF2 custom maps 
There was a comp vs pub match event publicised around here (though i can't remember whom by (floor_master?) around the end of summer. Funny you should mention this because comp players won most 5cp maps but lost all the A/D maps. So who plays better defense?
It's interesting because perhaps that's because pubs generally hate 5cp whilst comp hate A/D. But that statement seems subjective, especially considering the insufficient sources that are capable of defining a more capable team (pub or comp) in terms of assault or defense.
The majority of public players out experience comp in defensive tactics, mostly because in public play it's the easiest score harvesting method, thus they consistently play defense. From a pub perspective i would presume better assault capability over defense. But that's merely a presumption.
I wonder if the demo still works, I'm pretty sure there was an .avi version floating around with the demo as well. It would be good for you to see for yourself what actually happens in pub vs comp and see the real differences staring you in the face.
On topic: I can't remember whether i said this already though, but with only 3 official CTF, one being community based, and another a KOTH conversion. It would be nice to see a CTF comp.
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aa
- Jul 19, 2009
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you also than remember that the match was in highlander format and 6v9
if 9 people cant take down 6 on gravelpit regardless of skill level thats just dumb.
it was also on badwater.
if you think a team of 6 pub players would ever "out-strategize" a team of 6 comp players thats kind of wrong
if 9 people cant take down 6 on gravelpit regardless of skill level thats just dumb.
it was also on badwater.
if you think a team of 6 pub players would ever "out-strategize" a team of 6 comp players thats kind of wrong
You are as presumptious as you are poor and irish.
It was badlands and badwater, gravelpit was not played. Plus it was only highlander format for the pubs. Comp used 2 scouts, one med, one demo and 2 soldiers.
But to the point, the circumstance is entirely contextual. To argue 'theoretically' which way or the other is moot.
To respond to your derogatory pub play statement, telling me that several competent comp players that never play a game mode let alone the map in question are able to out-strategise several competent pub players on a map they likely play 24/7 is laughable. The general consensus from comp players is such that 6vs9 was more than fair, so to debate it as otherwise is pedantic, hypocritical and pathetic. Comp players are simply not on even grounds for A/D play because they are inexperienced in the maps, lack the player support and inexperienced in the necassery defencive classes (engi and heavy). As is true at the other end of the spectrum for public players on 5cp. The match shows this, so to argue rhetoric against impirical data shows the exact arragont attitude most comp players show that everyone else is sick and tired of.
pub players may have a reputation for being idiots, such is the general player base of TF2. But to label all pubs as incompetent players is arragont, naive and immature.
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aa
- Jul 19, 2009
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I have 6 hats so that nullifies that
I never said it was gravelpit. Said comp players on gpit would not lose to pub players on gravelpit a true A/D map, not a PL
Competitive and payload do not go hand in hand unless you count the very few highlander leagues
Where did I do this?
you braught up gravelpit in the middle of your PUG match discussion, implying that it was one of the maps played (intentional or not).
PL, Multi-stage PL, multistage CP and Tri CP are all A/D. The implication of PL as fuax A/D demonstrates the level of elitist subjective views shown by competitive players, regarding game mode's and maps.
The context of your statement regarding 9vs6 play was within 2 sentences refering to competitive vs public play, stating 9 players not defeating 6 players would be stupid. Implying that public players are stupid because they cannot defeat 6 comp players (in your made up, hypothetical scenario).
If your implications were not intentional, you might want to include some form of structure, format and grammer in your posts to stop future confusion regarding the actual meaning and intent of your post.
Any way, this is getting slightly off topic.