Structure vs detail: post your screenshots

Shmitz

Old Hat
aa
Nov 12, 2007
1,128
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A conversation in the steam chat got me thinking it might be interesting if people posted screenshots of their maps minus all of the details and such that don't affect visibility, showing just the basic underlying structure. There might be some interesting comparisons to make on level construction.

To get a good hammer screenshot of your map's structure, do the following:
  1. Find a good spot to take a picture of and make your 3d view large enough for a good shot.
  2. Click the "Auto" tab in your visgroups sidebar.
  3. Uncheck "Tool Brushes", "Entities", and "World Detail".
  4. Open up the "World Geometry" group and uncheck "Displacements"
  5. Set the 3d view to "3d Flat"
  6. Hit your print screen key and paste it into an image editor.
  7. Recheck "World Detail".
  8. Set the 3d view to one of the Textured settings.
  9. Take another screenshot.

I'll get it started:

Outside in cp_science2:
structure01_science2.jpg


Backyard (point C) in cp_roswell:
structure02_roswell.jpg


Courtyard area (point A) in cp_roswell:
structure03_roswell.jpg


Feed storage area (point B) in cp_roswell:
structure04_roswell.jpg
 

Vilepickle

Banned
Oct 25, 2007
372
199
A few that are decent:

Castle
castle-1a.jpg

castle-1b.jpg


castle-2a.jpg

castle-2b.jpg


castle-3a.jpg

castle-3b.jpg


Impact
impact-1a.jpg

impact-1b.jpg


impact-2a.jpg

impact-2b.jpg
 

phatal

L6: Sharp Member
Jan 8, 2008
259
21
My level is only half way done, if that, but my center room is mostly complete. I guess because of my custom visgroups my ss's look different as far as what's included so I did as you asked for the first one (with custom visgroups active), then I did second ss with groups disabled as requested, and the 3rd ss is everything turned on.

3D FLAT
30d157ce.jpg


REQUESTED GROUPS REMOVED
4dbd9460.jpg


ALL GROUPS
f26e4bab.jpg
 

Koei

L4: Comfortable Member
Feb 23, 2008
186
4
Displacements show the brushes they were made with? It's a displacement it's meant to be bent. :)

Open up the "World Geometry" group and uncheck "Displacements"

Doesn't this remove the displacements from view? I can understand brushes behind displacements to seal the map, but this is in the middle. Maybe I'm being stupid, who knows :blink:
 

Shmitz

Old Hat
aa
Nov 12, 2007
1,128
746
You're right Koei. That screenshot shows that there are brushes (presumably nodraw) inside those displacements. I don't think it's necessary to have them there when they don't have to seal the world or block backlighting. If there is a reason to have them there, they should still probably be detail brushes, since they're not really blocking visibility.
 

Vilepickle

Banned
Oct 25, 2007
372
199
You're right Koei. That screenshot shows that there are brushes (presumably nodraw) inside those displacements. I don't think it's necessary to have them there when they don't have to seal the world or block backlighting. If there is a reason to have them there, they should still probably be detail brushes, since they're not really blocking visibility.

Actually, in some cases they can help vis drastically. If you look at the Impact middle screenshot, I have a nodraw brush in the middle where the hill is. Without it, the entire other base ramproom was being drawn from the other team's ramproom. With it, the vis stops there and I get a much better experience.
 

YM

LVL100 YM
aa
Dec 5, 2007
7,135
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when I put them in I thought that they'd actually help with cutting up vis but upon reflection I doubt they are doing anything at all. I may aswell remove them.
 

Shmitz

Old Hat
aa
Nov 12, 2007
1,128
746
Actually, in some cases they can help vis drastically. If you look at the Impact middle screenshot, I have a nodraw brush in the middle where the hill is. Without it, the entire other base ramproom was being drawn from the other team's ramproom. With it, the vis stops there and I get a much better experience.

Yeah, but in your case you have an expansive nodraw brush that is blocking vis between two doorways. For a thin archway off to the side, I don't think they benefit performance any.

I'm just trying to make sure there's no confusion about nodraws behind displacements. There's no rule stating they have to be there. The usual reasons you would have them are to seal the world or to prevent light (usually from the sky) from casting light through the back of the displacement. This is function following form. In your screenshot, it's more form following function. It's the difference between making a displacement and putting a nodraw brush behind it, and making a nodraw brush and wrapping a displacement around it.
 

l3eeron

L8: Fancy Shmancy Member
Jan 4, 2008
593
88
What a great idea, thanks guys for taking the time to post these. It sparked a new idea idea I want to try. Sometimes, I forget to think of the baby steps before I get caught up in the details.
 

phatal

L6: Sharp Member
Jan 8, 2008
259
21
Doesn't this remove the displacements from view? I can understand brushes behind displacements to seal the map, but this is in the middle. Maybe I'm being stupid, who knows :blink:

I wasn't thinking when I responded with that. I had a brain fart, I was thinking about the view withing hammer for displacements. :p
 
Dec 25, 2007
566
439
The rule of thumb I use for nodraw behind displacements: if you were to use plain brushes instead of displacements for this feature, would you make them func_detail? If so, don't put a nodraw behind.
 

YM

LVL100 YM
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Dec 5, 2007
7,135
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well this turned into a discussion of my displacement technique... I'm gunna put it right now.
I took some pictures with mat_fullbright 2 on and I find them most interesting:

cpbloodstainedb3fullbritj9.jpg


cpbloodstainedb3fullbrixr9.jpg
 

YM

LVL100 YM
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Dec 5, 2007
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Bump, it would be good to see some other people's maps for comparison....
 

DJive

Cake or Death?
aa
Dec 20, 2007
1,465
741
=( would do mine, but with the exception of the floor, its all func_detail =p
 

YM

LVL100 YM
aa
Dec 5, 2007
7,135
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8 month bump! woo go me :thumbup:

Since this is a pretty awesome thread I thought I'd do a new comparison for it from Devil's half-acre: