How hard is it, roughly, for a beginner map maker to make a PLR?

Jethro

MUSty Complainer
Nov 2, 2009
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Jetamo(Jethro) here, long time TF2 player, first time mapper. I've dabbled in Hammer once or twice, but not really making anything(a block room. xp)

I was wondering how hard it would be to make a one-stage Payload Race? Standard stuff, maybe an alpine setting. Anywhere I should start, etc?

EDIT: Also..say I properly make the map and stuff, is it easy to replace the cart with something else(if I get a model)?
 
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Ida

deer
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Jan 6, 2008
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PL and PLR are probably some of the hardest modes in terms of entity systems. It's pretty complex, so expect lots of bugs to fix. CTF, on the other hand, is always relatively bug-free, so I'd start there if I were you.

There's nothing particularly hard about design, I guess, you'll just have to be mindful of chokepoints and spam.
 
Jan 31, 2008
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I'd say start out with a koth or an arena map. They are easy to make, and you'll get a hang of how you map for TF2. Your first map will most likely not be released, nor will it be any good, which is why I recommend making smaller maps!
 
Feb 14, 2008
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On the Rutherford-Brown Difficulty Scale I'd say it's about 15.6RBs, though that's a rough estimate.
 

gamemaster1996

L13: Stunning Member
Sep 30, 2009
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My advice is to use prefabs as that will usually do most of the work except placement and making the enviroment.
 

strangemodule

L5: Dapper Member
Sep 10, 2009
223
59
If you really wish to make a PLR map, I strongly recommend picking up ABS's Ultimate Resource Pack. It's in a sticky on the Mapping Tutorial and Resources section, I think.
 

Blue552

L3: Member
Sep 16, 2009
137
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I don't think even the best mappers here could make it from scratch without any prior knowledge.
 

Ravidge

Grand Vizier
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May 14, 2008
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You should start by learning how to use the tools in hammer. Once you've done that it's much easier to make up a actual map layout. (Don't design a map before you know what a displacement is... like I did, gah)

As for gamemodes, plr is one of the more entity heavy ones.. you'll be fine using boojum's prefab, but it probably will be difficult for you to troubleshoot the system once something breaks (it will).

Make lots of small test maps where you teach yourself all the things/tools, also post here if you get stuck or need help. Plenty of people around has gone through the same process and are eager to share what they've learned ;)
 

Jethro

MUSty Complainer
Nov 2, 2009
287
281
Bump with a new question!

Been reading the Valve wiki-abob with the tutorial, and doing okay. Just wondering if there's anything TF2-related I need to download, etc. Keep reading about "A Boojum Snark's Ultimate Map Resource Pack" etc, but I was wondering if there's a proper list anywhere?
 

UKCS-Alias

Mann vs Machine... or... Mapper vs Meta?
aa
Sep 8, 2008
1,264
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If you use to learn the pack of ABS then you dont realy need a massive knowledge of the plr system, you only need to know how to map for any other map and how path_tracks work. Then you should be able to get a PLR map already.

And what you need for mapping with TF2 is TF2 installed and source SDK. Thats all, TF2 will automaticly also install any HL2 files which are sometimes used in tf2. Source sdk gives hammer and some tools you need to compile your map with. That pack of ABS makes it easier to use and is therefor also recommended simply as all entities show up with all settings (which with just SDK isnt the case).

As said before it can be easier to learn to map with a CTF, Arena or koth map system. Those are the most basic ones and often are better for beginners as they can scrap maps easier. In a large 3 stage map its a pain if you have to scrap it (and in some cases it realy is recommended, beginners can make huge mistakes - sometimes even the best mappers do that, they do alpha and beta testing for a reason).