How early should I start a thread for my map?

Amidio

L2: Junior Member
Apr 14, 2012
71
17
I'm nearly at a point where I feel confident enough in my map to actually post it on the forum, and I have to ask, how early should I? There are currently about a half-dozen problems that need fixing and the lighting is nowhere near done, but should I post to see if there are any glaring flaws I'm missing?
 

Freyja

aa
Jul 31, 2009
2,994
5,813
Whenever you want. I personally wait till I have a playable download, but other don't. Don't feel contained, there's no rules for this.
 

Sel

Banned
Feb 18, 2009
1,239
2,570
Post the thread after you sort out the issues you can see yourself, otherwise you'll just get a bunch of people telling you about issues you already know about, or people won't post at all because it looks sloppy since you didn't fix some simple stuff.
 

grazr

Old Man Mutant Ninja Turtle
aa
Mar 4, 2008
5,441
3,814
Well you should post pics ASAP so you can get advice on your scale and game mode mechanics (such as custom CP count or other gimmicks, etc).

Once you're happy with the concept and layout, make sure the important stuff that prevents exploits like spawn camping etc is in place, properly functioning respawn rooms, respawn visualisers and spawn doors with the appropriate team filtering, environment lighting, etc etc. Basically when the map is working you can post a version for testing.
 

ics

http://ics-base.net
aa
Jun 17, 2010
841
541
I'm nearly at a point where I feel confident enough in my map to actually post it on the forum, and I have to ask, how early should I? There are currently about a half-dozen problems that need fixing and the lighting is nowhere near done, but should I post to see if there are any glaring flaws I'm missing?

Be aware that the people around here and elsewhere can be quite cruel or you may feel they are such when they comment your work. Everyone has a different point of view that differs from yours.

If you feel lost, post it now. If you know you can fix the things yourself and you do not need help at this point, then don't post yet. Just keep on mind that someone else might spot flaws and give you ideas that you might find usefull.
 

grazr

Old Man Mutant Ninja Turtle
aa
Mar 4, 2008
5,441
3,814
Be aware that the people around here and elsewhere can be quite cruel or you may feel they are such when they comment your work. Everyone has a different point of view that differs from yours.

"Heh".

Cruel is such a subjective term i find. Is it cruel to lie to someone to protect their feelings even though they'd be at an disadvantage? Is it cruel to kill a mortally wounded pet? Is it cruel to point out the flaws in someones creative work?

People will always be offended on some level when their work comes under harsh criticism, but without it the project will be doomed to mediocrity or worse. It's a necessity. The design world is no place for the overly sensitive.

In this case my advice would be simply to look at all comments objectively and to consider the reasons why certain people might be hostile to any one of your design ideas. Hostility to a design choice usually comes from frustration, not an ambiguous hatred at you as an individual or ego/superiority complex on their part.
 
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Pocket

Half a Lambert is better than one.
aa
Nov 14, 2009
4,694
2,579
Post the thread after you sort out the issues you can see yourself, otherwise you'll just get a bunch of people telling you about issues you already know about, or people won't post at all because it looks sloppy since you didn't fix some simple stuff.

Translation: Don't post until after you've built your cubemaps. ;)

(And played through the map yourself to make sure the mechanics work properly. The control points add the right amount of time, the cart goes all the way to the end without getting stuck, the spawn rooms all lock and unlock properly, that sort of thing. Unless you have a really weird mechanic that requires players to be in two different places, like the capture zone in Gloryhole, you should be able to check it all with just one person. It's safe to assume that things like capture multipliers and blocking work automatically if everything else does.)
 

grazr

Old Man Mutant Ninja Turtle
aa
Mar 4, 2008
5,441
3,814
...(And played through the map yourself to make sure the mechanics work properly. The control points add the right amount of time...

Well you can kinda guess about capture times if you're experienced enough, but that's why we have alpha (pre-artpass) testing. To make sure the map becomes balanced if it wasn't on its first release. Your first 1 or 2 map releases are almost garaunteed to have a number of issues like skewiff respawn waves and mis-timed control point timers. The point is to knock out 2 or 3 alpha's to hone those settings down with a little trial and error.
 

MangyCarface

Mapper
aa
Feb 26, 2008
1,626
1,325
I know of one good map that had only one alpha, and that was Badwater. If anyone can tell me of any maps that are genuinely good that appear out of nowhere in beta, I'd be interested to know.

They exist, but are locked away in my memory from about 2-3 years ago. Christ time flies
 

Pocket

Half a Lambert is better than one.
aa
Nov 14, 2009
4,694
2,579
Well you can kinda guess about capture times if you're experienced enough, but that's why we have alpha (pre-artpass) testing. To make sure the map becomes balanced if it wasn't on its first release. Your first 1 or 2 map releases are almost garaunteed to have a number of issues like skewiff respawn waves and mis-timed control point timers. The point is to knock out 2 or 3 alpha's to hone those settings down with a little trial and error.

What I meant was, to make sure you didn't forget to add all the outputs and whatnot. Sometimes maps slip into public tests with actual bugs. Double-checking the associated entities in Hammer is the best bet for catching that sort of thing, but if the map has never been played before at any stage, it can't hurt to do a dry run on your own.